Star Trek: Discovery: Season 2. The Ultimate Backpedal

Make her a Captain again, of the Shenzhou and send the ship through a portal which shoots them into the timeline after Nemesis

Or just make her a captain again but with a different name and make no mention of the horrible STD story line. As long as the writing was good I'm sure no one would give a shit that STD was being ignored.
 
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Overmind One

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Or just make her a captain again but with a different name and make no mention of the horrible STD story line. As long as the writing was good I'm sure no one would give a shit that STD was being ignored.

One of the healing steps to make Star Trek viable again as a mega-fan vehicle will necessarily require ghosting of the whole Discovery nightmare.
 

YJ02

Well Known GateFan
One of the healing steps to make Star Trek viable again as a mega-fan vehicle will necessarily require ghosting of the whole Discovery nightmare.
I agree completely. There is no doubt in my mind that ST fans would happily accept this.

They could have wake up in a unaltered prime timeline sick bay attended by 'The Doctor( Robert Picardo)' after being in a coma from a brain injury

it was all a dream.... :)
 

Overmind One

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They could have wake up in a unaltered prime timeline sick bay attended by 'The Doctor( Robert Picardo)' after being in a coma from a brain injury

it was all a dream.... :)

They could make it all a dream in the first episode of the new Picard series. :) But we all know that Kurtzman is probably proud of his dumb Trek ideas, since he has doubled down on them in all the Trek his sticky dirty little hands has touched. The studios seem completely uninterested in knowing the truth of NuTrek's failure, or realizing that Kurtzman was the wrong person to choose to helm the franchise. As long as he is involved, Star Trek will continue to die.
 
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YJ02

Well Known GateFan
They could make it all a dream in the first episode of the new Picard series. :) But we all know that Kurtzman is probably proud of his dumb Trek ideas, since he has doubled down on them in all the Trek his sticky dirty little hands has touched. The studios seem completely uninterested in knowing the trust of NuTrek's failure, or realizing that Kurtzman was the wrong person to choose to helm the franchise. As long as he is involved, Star Trek will continue to die.

what about the info in that vd i posted where the guy said that they HAD TO change the look of the show and alter it enough so that cbs (or viacom or who the F ever) would get in a tizzy over rights,etc?

i could get that, but then, they didn't change humans and the didnt change the starships all that much given the fact that in the Prime universe the are many variants to starfleet ships

i think ppl are looking for easy outs and 'explain aways' to apologize for the show
 

Joelist

What ship is this?
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The rights are an underlying issue. So long as they insist on using the Paramount license we will be doomed to something akin to the Kelvin-verse.
 

Overmind One

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The rights are an underlying issue. So long as they insist on using the Paramount license we will be doomed to something akin to the Kelvin-verse.

THAT is why Kurtzman is in there in the first place. CBS already owns the rights to "real" Star Trek like we know from TNG/DS9/Voy/Ent. Discovery is a show both of them can use (Paramount and CBS) for making money, but their middle ground looks like far out in left field to most Trek fans. Why can't they see that fans are NOT going to just sit back and let them do whatever the hell they damned well please? You can bet with high confidence that CBS All Access is taking note of The Orville's success with Star Trek fans. I think it will be even more pronounced than last season because CBS is so cocksure it has a winner with the new changes they are making.

Has anyone noticed that Discovery's nacelles look like stiletto heels?
 

Overmind One

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The shills are out there already for Season 2 of Discovery trying to create buzz, but they are failing. Mostly because of this:

NotSpock.PNG


THAT is supposed to be Spock! And they are still trying to claim that Discovery is in the prime timeline.
 

Overmind One

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Now that Kurtzman has said that they cannot line up canon between Discovery and TOS, does this mean they will not even attempt it anymore? Probably. Their Pike is on Discovery, which never existed in the prime timeline. And their Spock has a sister, and the Discovery Vulcans can do interstellar mind melds. Also, STD went to the mirror universe before Kirk did which makes no sense either. So it is a complete disaster in terms of canon.
 

Overmind One

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CRINGE....
 
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Overmind One

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Okay, I had to make a whole new Season 2 thread for episode reviews only. I recently canceled my 30-day trial of CBS All Access because I just could not find a reason in the service to keep it. That was two days ago. However, Season 2 od Star Trek discovery debuted last night, and I could not watch it. Like Season 1, I want to be able to say I watched every episode before I take a position as a hater. Guess what happened when I went back to CBS All Access to start up a subscription? I was presented with this:

FireSaleCBS.PNG


:shep_lol::icon_rotflmao: Don't they call this sort of thing a "Fire Sale"? :) Whatever, it will cost me next to nothing for the next two months. That means I will be able to provide juicy detailed reviews of this show.
 

Joelist

What ship is this?
Staff member
Basically the episode can be summarized as "Michael Burnham is the bestest, greatest, most skilled and indeed most physically impressive being in the universe". Just forget how she acts like a psycho; forget that she started the Klingon war and is responsible for the deaths of millions including Captain Georgiou; forget and remember....Burnham is the all being!
 

Overmind One

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Season 2, Episode 1: "Brother"
Basically the episode can be summarized as "Michael Burnham is the bestest, greatest, most skilled and indeed most physically impressive being in the universe". Just forget how she acts like a psycho; forget that she started the Klingon war and is responsible for the deaths of millions including Captain Georgiou; forget and remember....Burnham is the all being!

TheMichael.png


I will have to fill in the review for this tonight after I have watched the episode. I started it, but after 15 minutes I felt a need to load the dishwasher and sweep off the porch. :) I will post it here later tonight.
 
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Lord Ba'al

Well Known GateFan
So, episode 2 of season 2. Really not so bad if you ask me. There were of course cringe-worthy moments as can be expected for this show. But I feel this episode showed that they have really realized that they royally screwed up with season 1 and they have tried hard to turn the show into a direction which is more in-line with real Star Trek without making the transition too hard, as in making it an entirely different show all of a sudden. I'm actually impressed by how they've managed to do this. If they can continue nudging the show in this manner throughout the rest of the season then by the end of this season it could actually be a lot more like the Star Trek we are used to and might even be rather good. Well, let's wait and see what happens. What I just wrote does kinda sound too good to be true, so it probably isn't. The spore drive is still there, so that sucks. Tilly is still magnificently annoying, probably more so than in season 1. There are many things to dislike, but you kinda have to learn to turn a blind eye to them as much as you can, that'll help you to find enjoyment in what is there.
 

Overmind One

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So, episode 2 of season 2. Really not so bad if you ask me. There were of course cringe-worthy moments as can be expected for this show. But I feel this episode showed that they have really realized that they royally screwed up with season 1 and they have tried hard to turn the show into a direction which is more in-line with real Star Trek without making the transition too hard, as in making it an entirely different show all of a sudden. I'm actually impressed by how they've managed to do this. If they can continue nudging the show in this manner throughout the rest of the season then by the end of this season it could actually be a lot more like the Star Trek we are used to and might even be rather good. Well, let's wait and see what happens. What I just wrote does kinda sound too good to be true, so it probably isn't. The spore drive is still there, so that sucks. Tilly is still magnificently annoying, probably more so than in season 1. There are many things to dislike, but you kinda have to learn to turn a blind eye to them as much as you can, that'll help you to find enjoyment in what is there.

I agree that they have made several tonal changes in the show, but because of the spore drive and the silly lore they are creating around those red spots, I cannot remotely connect it with Star Trek. That, and the "technology" they are showing us in the show. Magic holographic candles in Burnham's quarters in the first episode along with displays where you can "pinch" images from the screen and toss them into the air? The spinny pod things came right out of the Kelvin movies. I am also tired of the personal threads they have going in the show with Staments and Tilly. I was able to watch the whole episode, but I am still not feeling "Star Trek" in this show at all.
 

Lord Ba'al

Well Known GateFan
You have to see it as a reboot. Consider this. If there had been no other Star Trek before this and Roddenberry was alive right now and at the age he was when he first developed Star Trek, with the difference in the level of technology we have today compared to what we had in the sixties and the difference in societal structures between now and then, would Roddenberry still make Star Trek exactly as he made it originally? Or, would he challenge the notions we live by today as he did back then? Undoubtedly Star Trek created by Roddenberry right now would be quite different from the original Star Trek. I'm sure it wouldn't be much like Discovery, but then the creators of this show aren't Roddenberry.

I look at this show as a thing of its own. A separate entity aside from the older Star Trek shows. I would have liked a new Star Trek show like the older shows or a continuation of those shows, but because I can set this aside from those I am still able to enjoy it without being bothered by the continuity errors which bother you so much. Sure, I don't like the idea of the spore drive at all and especially not the way it makes the ship spin. But if I look at how the original shows all portray warp drive, it is really equally ridiculous. Imagine standing on a Star Ship which then instantly accelerates to the speed of light. There would be nothing left of you. I think deep down every Star Trek fan knows that this warp drive concept is ridiculously unfeasible, yet they've all come to accept and embrace it. Really it is just a gimmick. But it is a necessary gimmick as you can't tell the stories which are told in Star Trek if the ship takes millennia to reach it's next destination. The spore drive is basically the exact same thing, a gimmick to allow for certain stories to be formed, but more powerful than the warp drive. For me the most annoying part of the spore drive is the ridiculous concept of it with the mycelial network and then the spinning of the ship and stuff. You appear to be mostly hung up on the fact that there is no mention of the spore drive in the original shows and because this show pre-dates those and the spore drive is more powerful than warp drive this creates a continuity error. Just let it go and consider this unrelated to the other Star Trek shows and that problem disappears. No more continuity errors. Try to judge the show on its own merit only, as if no prior Star Trek ever existed. I know it'll be hard but it can be done. If you still don't like it then, fair enough, but you'll probably not like it for entirely different reasons than you do now, or you'll not like it a little bit less than you do now. ;)
 

Overmind One

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Staff member
You have to see it as a reboot. Consider this. If there had been no other Star Trek before this and Roddenberry was alive right now and at the age he was when he first developed Star Trek, with the difference in the level of technology we have today compared to what we had in the sixties and the difference in societal structures between now and then, would Roddenberry still make Star Trek exactly as he made it originally? Or, would he challenge the notions we live by today as he did back then? Undoubtedly Star Trek created by Roddenberry right now would be quite different from the original Star Trek. I'm sure it wouldn't be much like Discovery, but then the creators of this show aren't Roddenberry.

Roddenberry would never have done the "cool over logic" thing they are trying to do in Discovery. He never would have signed off on the Dutch angles, the flashy but illogically magical "tech", the shiny stylish uniforms with sneakers, the dark bridge, etc. Discovery relies way too much on flash and bang, and not enough on story. The story they are telling should be appropriate to the timeline of Star Trek, and that is not a function of how it looks. Roddenberry's "perfect" concept Trek was TNG. TOS was his "compromise" Trek. I am not sure he would have done DS9 at all, and he would take issue with many things in Voyager but not much. Enterprise would never have been done the way it was done with the trampling of canon. Canon IS important to Star Trek. You can't just change it or insert things into it retroactively. Creating new canon in a new show is okay, as long as Star Trek is extending it and not something entirely different like this show is.

I look at this show as a thing of its own. A separate entity aside from the older Star Trek shows. I would have liked a new Star Trek show like the older shows or a continuation of those shows, but because I can set this aside from those I am still able to enjoy it without being bothered by the continuity errors which bother you so much. Sure, I don't like the idea of the spore drive at all and especially not the way it makes the ship spin. But if I look at how the original shows all portray warp drive, it is really equally ridiculous. Imagine standing on a Star Ship which then instantly accelerates to the speed of light. There would be nothing left of you. I think deep down every Star Trek fan knows that this warp drive concept is ridiculously unfeasible, yet they've all come to accept and embrace it.

Not really. Warp drive is not really a gimmick at all, and the Star Trek method is actually being explored by NASA. How? Because the theoretical science behind it is sound: create a zone of space which is warped, and essentially the ship becomes isolated from normal space. Then, you can apply thrust to the bubble and not the ship, allowing it to travel faster than the speed of light. (See Albucuirre Warp Drive). The spore drive in Discovery is complete fantasy having ZERO basis in any sort of science. No, there are not spores permeating the galaxy, and even if there were, how could they be used to travel anywhere? THAT is ridiculous. The tardigrade and the chamber where Staments goes into a trance and sees his dead lover and all of that is just plain magic. It doesn't help to see the pixie dust swirling around him while he is in that chamber. Then there is the whirlygig ship movement. WHY? The ship does not need to spin like a drill, and how exactly does the spinning saucer section work in the process? It's all visual wow and no substance. Not Star Trek.

Really it is just a gimmick. But it is a necessary gimmick as you can't tell the stories which are told in Star Trek if the ship takes millennia to reach it's next destination. The spore drive is basically the exact same thing, a gimmick to allow for certain stories to be formed, but more powerful than the warp drive. For me the most annoying part of the spore drive is the ridiculous concept of it with the mycelial network and then the spinning of the ship and stuff. You appear to be mostly hung up on the fact that there is no mention of the spore drive in the original shows and because this show pre-dates those and the spore drive is more powerful than warp drive this creates a continuity error. Just let it go and consider this unrelated to the other Star Trek shows and that problem disappears. No more continuity errors. Try to judge the show on its own merit only, as if no prior Star Trek ever existed. I know it'll be hard but it can be done. If you still don't like it then, fair enough, but you'll probably not like it for entirely different reasons than you do now, or you'll not like it a little bit less than you do now. ;)

That would be nice, but this show is calling itself Star Trek and that can't be ignored. They are bringing in characters from real Star Trek and changing them into tropes that don't even remotely match the originals in behavior or background. As a fan, I can't be okay with this. I am no more likely to accept this crap as Star Trek as I would to go to a restaurant and order a steak and potatoes dinner and accept a plate of chicken and kale calling itself a steak dinner.
 
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