Helix: Love it or Hate it? (Awards Given)

[Overmind One]

Interesting point to ponder. I wonder if Helix was given a two-season order originally and the production company spent the majority of the budget on the first season? Either that or they shot their load on the first season thinking that would be it for the show but then got the renewal order and found they didn't have that much left in the production coffers.

Funny you should ponder that. I am starting to get "filled in" on how some of this shit works. This show, along with most others, do start out with a set deal of a specific initial run. The larger studios can afford to do pilots first sometimes, but the smaller entities (like Syfy) purchase their shows from a type of broker representing the production studios. The deal hinges upon advertising revenue, and the price of advertising on a given show is based upon it's viewership ratings and especially the viewing demographics. The more advertising dollars, the greater chance that a given show will be continued or new seasons ordered. Along those lines. Syfy did not produce this show or many of the others it airs.

Having said that, if the initial run was set at two seasons, and the ratings are dismal, then there is not much advertising money made, and the run ends with no obligation to the broker or the production company. Im sure every deal is different, but they all basically follow the money.

 

[Joelist]

That does explain a little the recent SyFy spate of 2 season precommittals and also USA Network doing renewals for 2 seasons as opposed to one - they are getting a "bundle" price I am guessing.

 

[Overmind One]

That does explain a little the recent SyFy spate of 2 season precommittals and also USA Network doing renewals for 2 seasons as opposed to one - they are getting a "bundle" price I am guessing.

Yes, that is correct. The price for the initial run is negotiated and the length of the run is negotiated. If there is a pilot, then the deal might just involve the pilot with no deal made on production until after ratings are collected. This explains both Ascension and the single episode of The After by Chris Carter. In the case of Defiance, the game company made for a sweet deal for Syfy because Trion was footing part of the bill plus they were promoting it indirectly with the game. I dont know specifics, and evidently it isnt exactly standardized, but it goes much like any leasing deal goes. The money from the deal goes to pay for the initial episodes, and the (presumed) added advertising revenue helps pay for the second season. But by the end of the run, if the show hasnt "taken off", it ends because there is no income to offset the production costs.

 

[Jim of WVa]

Interesting point to ponder. I wonder if Helix was given a two-season order originally and the production company spent the majority of the budget on the first season? Either that or they shot their load on the first season thinking that would be it for the show but then got the renewal order and found they didn't have that much left in the production coffers.

Last year, I got tired of the building that was supposed to be in the Arctic. Since Arctic Biosystems was supposed to be in international waters (ice pack), it would have been interesting if the building was treated as a floating ship.

 

[Jim of WVa]

Speaking of the USA network, has anyone else been watching the show Dig?

 

[Overmind One]

Speaking of the USA network, has anyone else been watching the show Dig?

What is it about?

 

[Joelist]

It's Da Vinci code style nonsense.

The quality of USA shows has gone into the tank over the past couple of seasons. Now they are all basically extended bedroom scenes and soapy as all get out.

 

[Overmind One]

It's Da Vinci code style nonsense.

The quality of USA shows has gone into the tank over the past couple of seasons. Now they are all basically extended bedroom scenes and soapy as all get out.

So pass on it? Im still not over Ascension! I mean...what were they thinking? And this show Helix, it did a Jekyll and Hyde instead of morphing smoothly into a reboot like the first Primeval did. Only in the last two episodes did it get sort of intriguing, but it was just the wrong thing to end the cliffhanger on, and it was just too out there. The way they left it, we will still be stuck on that dumb island if it gets renewed. Lets just hope it got canceled. :anim_59:

 

[Joelist]

I'd say pass.

 

[Joelist]

And yes Ascension was drivel. Especially when they did the "reveal" - at that point it entered flat out stupidland.

 

[Overmind One]

Last year, I got tired of the building that was supposed to be in the Arctic. Since Arctic Biosystems was supposed to be in international waters (ice pack), it would have been interesting if the building was treated as a floating ship.

I agree, but the tease for season 2 was Paris! We saw Julia sitting down at the Board table of Ilaria, and the new look was slick and classy and still had an air of plausibility. Instead, we come back and Alan is literally picking apples dressed as some kind of monk in an abbey. And we got ghosts? Why did we get ghosts? The black blood is gone, and they replaced it with honey and gave us cauliflower mouth zombies, eyeball eating talking cannibal zombies, and crazy cult girl. :facepalm:. They ended up with immortal baby suspended in a jar full of liquid that is vulnerable to cracks too? :moody:

I like your idea about the entire base being a floating ship.

 

[shavedape]

So pass on it? Im still not over Ascension! I mean...what were they thinking? And this show Helix, it did a Jekyll and Hyde instead of morphing smoothly into a reboot like the first Primeval did. Only in the last two episodes did it get sort of intriguing, but it was just the wrong thing to end the cliffhanger on, and it was just too out there. The way they left it, we will still be stuck on that dumb island if it gets renewed. Lets just hope it got canceled. :anim_59:

I agree, but the tease for season 2 was Paris! We saw Julia sitting down at the Board table of Ilaria, and the new look was slick and classy and still had an air of plausibility. Instead, we come back and Alan is literally picking apples dressed as some kind of monk in an abbey. And we got ghosts? Why did we get ghosts? The black blood is gone, and they replaced it with honey and gave us cauliflower mouth zombies, eyeball eating talking cannibal zombies, and crazy cult girl. :facepalm:. They ended up with immortal baby suspended in a jar full of liquid that is vulnerable to cracks too? :moody:

I like your idea about the entire base being a floating ship.

The story shift had to be based on Ron Moore's lack of direction and his cheap production economics. He chose the island story line because he knew they could cheaply produce it in the Canadian woods. It didn't require much in the way of CGI so that was clearly an enticement to go with this lame second season story. So basically, fans of the original story line were given the shaft due to Moore's inability to maintain a complete story arch from start to finish coupled with his penuriousness.

And this is the crux of the problem with Ron Moore's productions, he fails at having a full story arch mapped out. Remember how he lied about having a complete story for BSG? Instead we ended up with a series that was clearly floundering for direction. The show didn't know where it was going. And that same issue is evident with Helix. It's obvious. Moore had the first season figured out (more or less) but that's it. And correct me if I'm wrong here but didn't they originally claim that Helix was to be a limited run series? So if that's the case and they got picked up for an additional season then obviously they just tacked on a new story because they didn't know what else to do. Which just goes to show, again, Moore's inability to concoct a full, cogent story arch.

Or if I'm wrong and they knew they would get two full seasons from the start then that still proves Moore's inability to handle things. But I do think it's the former in that Moore and company have been flying blind -- again. The zombie thing proves it. Remember how the show was initially promoted as an escaped zombie virus? Yeah, what happened with that? :rolleye0014: So there ya go, just more proof that Moore and the people he associates with don't know what the hell they are doing.

*And yes, I know Moore didn't write the concept but he happily climbed on board to produce it. He is the biggest name attached to it so he most definitely bears responsibility for how badly it turned out. The creative buck stops with him.

 

[Overmind One]

Season 2 was literally thrown together. Its like they decided upon the locale first, and then decided on the look and feel of the thing (by ripping off Lost and some other shows), then went out and got a bunch of new drama graduates from a table at the nearest Starbucks and started making it up as they went along. It was awful.

 

[Jim of WVa]

It's Da Vinci code style nonsense.

The quality of USA shows has gone into the tank over the past couple of seasons. Now they are all basically extended bedroom scenes and soapy as all get out.

No. Dig is about the efforts of a group of out there Jews and Christians to restart the temple sacrificial system as outlined in the book of Numbers in the Old Testament.

 

[shavedape]

Season 2 was literally thrown together. Its like they decided upon the locale first, and then decided on the look and feel of the thing (by ripping off Lost and some other shows), then went out and got a bunch of new drama graduates from a table at the nearest Starbucks and started making it up as they went along. It was awful.

What gets me is that they could have written an interesting second season if they had really tried. The "lost island" gimmick was just a cynically cheap move, both economically and artistically. The virus story is interesting enough on its own. It didn't need weird embellishments. They should have just focused on that instead of going off on this weird cult tangent.

 

[Joelist]

No. Dig is about the efforts of a group of out there Jews and Christians to restart the temple sacrificial system as outlined in the book of Numbers in the Old Testament.

Oh please....secret plot going back thousands of years? Suds galore? Magic stones? A priest whose feet supposedly must never touch the earth? It's dumb, soapy, conspiracy theory garbage,

 

[Jim of WVa]

Oh please....secret plot going back thousands of years? Suds galore? Magic stones? A priest whose feet supposedly must never touch the earth? It's dumb, soapy, conspiracy theory garbage,

There is no secret plot going back thousands of years ago.

 

[Joelist]

Yes there is Jim. That is the whole underlying plot. Let me quote their own description:

The holiest city on earth has an unholy secret . . . From the executive producers of Homeland and Heroes, USA Network presents DIG, a thrilling ten-part television event. Starring Golden Globe nominee Jason Isaacs and Emmy Award-winner Anne Heche.

When Peter Connelly, an FBI agent recently stationed in Jerusalem, begins investigating the murder of a young American, he realizes that he has uncovered an ancient international conspiracy that threatens to change the course of human history. Certain that the dangerous prophecy is nearing fruition, Peter must race against the clock to unravel its mystery. From a remote farm in Norway, to an enigmatic compound in New Mexico, to the serpentine tunnels of Jerusalem, this immersive, fast-paced adventure will take viewers on a quest for a truth that will shake the world's beliefs to its very core.

Shot in contemporary Jerusalem against the backdrop of such historic sites as the Temple Mount, as well as in Croatia and New Mexico, DIG premieres on Thursday, March 5 at 10/9c. Only on USA Network. #DIGDEEPER

It's drivel and with the low ratings don't expect a renewal.

 

[Jim of WVa]

Yes there is Jim. That is the whole underlying plot. Let me quote their own description:
...

There are Jews trying to reestablish the temple sacrificial system. That is not a secret.

 

[Joelist]

Again Jim, read their own description of their show. I even bolded the relevant text. The whole story is about unfolding a secret ancient conspiracy. They even created fictional secret societies to carry it out.

Were I them I would try to wrap it up this season because the ratings are terrible.