The Science of Star Trek vs the Magic of Star Wars - the 10 Year Flame War!

[Overmind One]

Most of the people who say this are covering for their lack of cognitive ability.

You will never understand why both Bluce and I think this is funny.

 

[YJ02]

8 out of 10.

I missed #6 on account of a typo (put a period between 6 and Green instead of a Comma) and I just skipped through #10 (one example of numeric pattern hunting was enough ).

Remember this one from another thread we did a while ago?



http://www.gatefans.net/gforums/threads/ftl-travel-here-we-come.25166/page-13#post-812066

I KNEW you would do well

 

[Overmind One]

So, not counting that period, you've scored the highest here with an almost perfect score.

A natural geek.

 

[Overmind One]

Retard.

Poseur.

 

[Overmind One]

So.....the likelihood that anything remotely resembling the "royalty" and social systems we see in Star Wars would ever happen in our future is another reason it's fantasy. The future of Star trek shows us government, but it looks like a socialist meritocracy to me. The universe of Star Wars looks like an oligarchy/plutocracy.

 

[YJ02]

I got 7 out of 10. Thing is, I see people working in STEM fields who do not seem to belong in their jobs because they lack the ability to think outside of established parameters (outside the box). Believe it or not, amongst these are instructors or professors of STEM subjects. Most of them can rattle off things in their books in a heartbeat, but cannot put much of it in practice in real life applications. Other times, I meet 9 year old kids of friends (usually boys) who have managed to unravel complex networking problems with no formal instruction. Frequently I get from them stuff like "My game would not work, so I ----------------- and that fixed it".

Is it possible that certain people are simply "brain wired" to be technological?

while attending those course I was taking in psychology (for the masters of counseling I was doing to burn up my remaining VA money), we had some readings on the ongoing studies and research being done on this

the psych professors usually dont call it STEM vs non STEM

ours called it "MATH PPL vs Social Studies"!

the studies ppl are doing tend to be focusing on genetics instead of any functional applications for it; like say in career counseling or aptitude testing, job placement,etc (other countries have been doing this for awhile with or without knowledge of the STEM vs Non stem issue BTW)

i am not going to try and list everything i remember about it here--most of it is just "weedy stuff" that in one way or the other 'dances about' the issues that there are diff's at varying levels, in ppl.

seems math/stem ppl like to have plans and definite boundaries;where to "go" next. they use the GPS,we just drive (not that we know everything or don't get lost). the ytend to like personal tech items-we tend to use them as the tools they are.

but I don't think that anyone will ever be able to establish a definitive "manual" for the two types; the world is always changing-ppl change with it

and as i said before-these are just typologies not castes.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Like I say-I am a proud member of the social studies group

but then, when I tell ppl I was surveyor in the army (when before we got our hand held computing devices we had to compute the surveys 'longhand' using log and anti logs and some trig.geometry, blah,blah) some ppl in my class had issues in understanding how I did it...

...well, when I can see a practical application for that kind of math-then I can do it. when it was all on the blackboard or in a book in school, I was just like "yeah,need a little help here!"

but then-go to history or psych or any other non STEM course and I would be "that guy" who could take a test, get at least a 90 all without studying.

English comp,spelling in grade school? Killed it--easy,peasy

Algebra 2 in 10th grade?

when I built the decks on our house, back when I had the phys ability to do so, I never drew any plans or thought it all out ahead of time. I just went with it; established the posts and did the support framing. Used supporting tools when necessary (levels, plumb bob,etc), but only when necessary. It just kind of flows from visioning to the building. And yes, it is all plumb,square and level and 'true'--and still standing.

Guy asked me where I got the plans for my pond (the one I have pictures of in the DIY thread), where I bought the insert,etc. I just told him I started digging, found my shape and depth, put in the underlayment and liner and done.

Guy said that would be "scary" for him to do it like that..I cannot fathom that kind of thinking

 

[Jim of WVa]

I took the test just now, and it's a dumb test! I do not see where any of the questions asked would reveal any sort of aptitude for STEM thinking patterns. .

A prize is located behind one of three curtains. After you choose a curtain, the prize-master opens a curtain that has no prize behind it and gives you the option to switch curtains. If you decide to switch curtains, what is the probability that your curtain has the prize behind it?

Really?

The web site appears to be a SPAM site for dubious colleges with internet learning programs like Liberty University and Western Governors University.

A university cannot be very good, if it requires constant advertising to attract students.

 

[Jim of WVa]

I knew you would score high--i am sure OM and JIM would score high as well-probably JOE too--just guessing of course based on my "observations" here

Number 7? I didn't even take time to consider an answer-I just typed something to get to the next question!

I did rather poorly. The timed nature of the test and the difficulty I had in determining where to put my answer messed me up. I do better on those standardized tests that are given by educators and organizations like Mensa.

 

[Overmind One]

I did rather poorly. The timed nature of the test and the difficulty I had in determining where to put my answer messed me up. I do better on those standardized tests that are given by educators and organizations like Mensa.

Maybe you did poorly, but that means nothing really. You have a Ph.D. and you are an engineer. Obviously STEM. I would take your demonstrated knowledge over any of these dumb test scores.

 

[Jim of WVa]

I took the test again and got 6 correct.

I do not see what this has to do with liking Star Trek or Star Wars. Star Wars is a basic story about good versus evil. Star Trek TNG was sometimes silly, but the Borg episodes were good. J.J. Abrams Trek is closer to classic Star Wars than classic Star Trek.

 

[Jim of WVa]

Maybe you did poorly, but that means nothing really. You have a Ph.D. and you are an engineer. Obviously STEM. I would take your demonstrated knowledge over any of these dumb test scores.

ONLY within my area of expertise. I did not install Linux on my computer until you demonstrated how easy it was. Still, I do a lot better with tests that involve geometry and algebra.

 

[Overmind One]

ONLY within my area of expertise. I did not install Linux on my computer until you demonstrated how easy it was. Still, I do a lot better with tests that involve geometry and algebra.

Still, you are OBVIOUSLY a STEM type person. What if people went by a dumb test like that to determine whether or not you could handle an engineering project? It would be dumb. I pull your chain sometimes, but I never forget you have a Ph.D. I doubt you ordered it on Amazon. I am clueless in many things. Other things that come second nature to me are very difficult for others to grasp. I guess we are all like this in some fashion.

 

[Overmind One]

I took the test again and got 6 correct.

I do not see what this has to do with liking Star Trek or Star Wars. Star Wars is a basic story about good versus evil. Star Trek TNG was sometimes silly, but the Borg episodes were good. J.J. Abrams Trek is closer to classic Star Wars than classic Star Trek.

All tech in science fiction is "phony tech". The argument here is magic vs science. Phony tech is not the same as sparkly magic.

 

[Jim of WVa]

All tech in science fiction is "phony tech". The argument here is magic vs science. Phony tech is not the same as sparkly magic.

True, but some science fiction contain a good amount of real science. Even Larry Niven's Known Space stories, which include FTL travel, contain a large amount of real science in them. Alastair Reynolds' Revelation Space novels contain a good amount of real science. A great deal of the technology in Iain M. Banks' Culture stories is fanciful, but does not actually break any scientific law, except for FTL travel. One of Banks' novels involved an assassin with an explosive antimatter weapon implanted in her head that could be triggered with a thought. This is fanciful, but does not break any known physical law.

In real science news, biologists are working on a technique to regrow testicles for injured soldiers and other violence victims. Ten years ago, this would be considered science fiction.

 

[Overmind One]

True, but some science fiction contain a good amount of real science. Even Larry Niven's Known Space stories, which include FTL travel, contain a large amount of real science in them. Alastair Reynolds' Revelation Space novels contain a good amount of real science. A great deal of the technology in Iain M. Banks' Culture stories is fanciful, but does not actually break any scientific law, except for FTL travel. One of Banks' novels involved an assassin with an explosive antimatter weapon implanted in her head that could be triggered with a thought. This is fanciful, but does not break any known physical law.

In real science news, biologists are working on a technique to regrow testicles for injured soldiers and other violence victims. Ten years ago, this would be considered science fiction.

That is one set of novels I am unfamiliar with. Still, you are making the case for scientific principle over magic. There is no path in science which will lead to the Force or to a lightsaber. Science might lead to an astro droid which looks and functions like R2D2 (when he is a droid), but not his programming. There is no reason for a droid or robot to communicate with it's operators or humans using beeps and whistles, unless those are alarms and status sounds.

Both "imagined", but only one of them is magical.

 

[Jim of WVa]

The Star Trek transporter is effectively magic, and was introduced because of budgetary constraints at Desilu Studios. From what I understand about the Force and light sabers is that they are magic as well.

 

[Overmind One]

The Star Trek transporter is effectively magic, and was introduced because of budgetary constraints at Desilu Studios. From what I understand about the Force and light sabers is that they are magic as well.

One is magic only because of budgetary constraints, but in Trek they actually created more science fiction to explain the operation of the transporter and it was pretty damned creative (if basically magic with reference to science). Not the same as the Force or a lightsaber. The Fly used the transporter before Star Trek did.

Star Wars does not try or need to explain the magic within it, any more than Lord of the Rings needs to. Even Harry Potter tried to explain it's magic in a logical way, even if still 100% magical.

 

[YJ02]

The web site appears to be a SPAM site for dubious colleges with internet learning programs like Liberty University and Western Governors University.

A university cannot be very good, if it requires constant advertising to attract students.

agree

but the test is still valid

you can do it without entering in any personal info

i have seen other tests similar to this one in psych assessments class

 

[Jim of WVa]

https://www.newscientist.com/articl...ignal-might-have-been-from-comets-not-aliens/

Famous Wow! signal might have been from comets, not aliens

So, it wasn't the Vulcans.

 

[YJ02]

If ST can be credited with "everything thats anything" in our current world-i am calling this new invent for CAPRICA!

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-35230043