Future of Jobs

[YJ02]

People are ignoring Google Pay, Apple Pay, virtual credit cards, etc. The plastic card is money here

all of which can be turned off on a whim of law enforcement or anyone else who can access or pressure the banks to do so

dumb

the 'divorce' of cash from gol standard is bad enough=fiat money-

going even further into financial fantasy, that of beyond simple convenience to get cash ie-the atm--is just a maniacal idea for me

 

[Atlantis]

there is already talk ( on NPR at least ) of a 'national guaranteed income' movement to offset this problem

like the proles have on THE EXPANSE and I think a few european nations have (finland? sweden? not sure)

yes- if it happened it wouldn't 'create free time for ppl to become what they want' for most, it would create a society of professional, demotivated loafers ,paid to do nothing

the move to automate everything is just a financial money saver for the big corps--so long as we all still get a way to buy their stuff-they don't care-govt will follow their lead

Andrew Mcaffe thinks we might move towards a socialist like economy.

 

[Lord Ba'al]

Andrew Mcaffe thinks we might move towards a socialist like economy.

I believe this Andrew Mcaffe and I are on the same page. He says almost exactly what I was before. He's a bit more optimistic about it though. But then again, I'm a Bill and he looks like a Ted.

 

[heisenberg]

Okay, I am going to do a 180 on my stance on AI. After watching this video, we should view this as a word of caution ffs. THe guy robot is a psycho/sociopath. He has no ethical code in him.

 

[YJ02]

today i had watched a documentary on AI. 'hosted' by Michio Kaku, the show NEXTWORLD has several episodes on different future tech.

the 1st ep is on predicting the future with a big bit of it on AI

I find the statement by Kaku and others in the show of "by 2045, computers and their AI core will be as smart as a human and be able to process information better and faster then a human brain" a disturbing statement of near religious faith in science

Computers may become better and faster, but they will never be able to truly replace the human brain. AI does not have emotions or the ability to take alternate actions based on a case by case basis. It simply works using cold blunt logic.

Intelligence and computing speed needs to be tempered and filtered by the human brain. without that, can AI even allow itself to override logic and allow for the application of mitigating issues like abnormal human behavior? Or to follow ethical standards instead of logic alone?

If not, then cold logic would state that to follow 'survival of the fittest' in the most minute way is the way to go.

but human emotions, empathy and compassion does not allow us to do this. For example, we do not euthanize downs syndrome babies, we do not let the weak go intentionally hungry or not cared for to die. We have built systems and bureaucracies that override things like survival of the fittest and provide support for those who, left to logical decisions alone, would be allowed to die

Or, would an AI system in a nation's govt simply just choose to obliterate a foreign nation that is making hostile actions and just a overall nuisance to world peace (places like North Korea come to mind) and kill all of it inhabitants? this would be the logical use of our nation's military and economic power. to string along a rogue nation in peace talks and sanctions ,etc, is illogical and rarely productive. would an AI in charge just choose to nuke the place at the start?

in this show, they also give the example of a california town's police dept. the police use a predictive AI system that indicates where a crime will happen.''great! so what does the town do? they have their cops patrol only in those predicted hot spots

so what if a crime, not predicted, happens outside those zones? what about when criminals hire a hacker to either find out the patrol zones, or game the data so that the AI sends the patrols to a completely bogus zone leaving the rest of the town not patrolled? experience should show us that nearly all recent tech advancements have been followed by a way for criminals to hack it. why would this system be immune?

it is just too much faith in a fallible system. yes-any system designed by man IS fallible.

 

[heisenberg]

today i had watched a documentary on AI. 'hosted' by Michio Kaku, the show NEXTWORLD has several episodes on different future tech.

the 1st ep is on predicting the future with a big bit of it on AI

I find the statement by Kaku and others in the show of "by 2045, computers and their AI core will be as smart as a human and be able to process information better and faster then a human brain" a disturbing statement of near religious faith in science

Computers may become better and faster, but they will never be able to truly replace the human brain. AI does not have emotions or the ability to take alternate actions based on a case by case basis. It simply works using cold blunt logic.

Intelligence and computing speed needs to be tempered and filtered by the human brain. without that, can AI even allow itself to override logic and allow for the application of mitigating issues like abnormal human behavior? Or to follow ethical standards instead of logic alone?

If not, then cold logic would state that to follow 'survival of the fittest' in the most minute way is the way to go.

but human emotions, empathy and compassion does not allow us to do this. For example, we do not euthanize downs syndrome babies, we do not let the weak go intentionally hungry or not cared for to die. We have built systems and bureaucracies that override things like survival of the fittest and provide support for those who, left to logical decisions alone, would be allowed to die

Or, would an AI system in a nation's govt simply just choose to obliterate a foreign nation that is making hostile actions and just a overall nuisance to world peace (places like North Korea come to mind) and kill all of it inhabitants? this would be the logical use of our nation's military and economic power. to string along a rogue nation in peace talks and sanctions ,etc, is illogical and rarely productive. would an AI in charge just choose to nuke the place at the start?

in this show, they also give the example of a california town's police dept. the police use a predictive AI system that indicates where a crime will happen.''great! so what does the town do? they have their cops patrol only in those predicted hot spots

so what if a crime, not predicted, happens outside those zones? what about when criminals hire a hacker to either find out the patrol zones, or game the data so that the AI sends the patrols to a completely bogus zone leaving the rest of the town not patrolled? experience should show us that nearly all recent tech advancements have been followed by a way for criminals to hack it. why would this system be immune?

it is just too much faith in a fallible system. yes-any system designed by man IS fallible.

That 2045 is around the average date when many are predicting the birth of Artificial General intelligence.

China is already there almost

You know this computerised world is going to mean a more extremely controlled/contain world right? Empathy/emotions are going to be phased out of existence in the given generations to come. Bad memories will be able to be wiped off with a simple injection and they'll be able to implant fake memories into us.

 

[Overmind One]

That 2045 is around the average date when many are predicting the birth of Artificial General intelligence.

China is already there almost

You know this computerised world is going to mean a more extremely controlled/contain world right? Empathy/emotions are going to be phased out of existence in the given generations to come. Bad memories will be able to be wiped off with a simple injection and they'll be able to implant fake memories into us.

Um, NO dude! You really have a very pessimistic view of Humanity if you truly believe this. Do you have any idea what would happen if some government agency tried to force all those rural militia folks who own 80% of all firearms in America to submit to any thing like that? Even an SUV convoy going into a ghetto would have a hard time. Just not gonna happen. Where do you think the muscle to enforce any of this is going to come from? The way it works is that when TPTB cross certain lines, the masses rise up and KILL THEM ALL. That's how it works, EVERY time. Nobody is going to be erasing memories against our will, no organization/force/government will ever overpower the Human race in that fashion. EVER.

Relax dude! You got this...

 

[YJ02]

Um, NO dude! You really have a very pessimistic view of Humanity if you truly believe this. Do you have any idea what would happen if some government agency tried to force all those rural militia folks who own 80% of all firearms in America to submit to any thing like that? Even an SUV convoy going into a ghetto would have a hard time. Just not gonna happen. Where do you think the muscle to enforce any of this is going to come from? The way it works is that when TPTB cross certain lines, the masses rise up and KILL THEM ALL. That's how it works, EVERY time. Nobody is going to be erasing memories against our will, no organization/force/government will ever overpower the Human race in that fashion. EVER.

Relax dude! You got this...

maybe not tothose extremes

but

a concern is for the people who will line up to have this kind of shit in their homes and in their bodies. because you know, just like lining up for the latest i phone or galaxy, the educated idiots, and those plain idiots who aspire to be like them will line up for this stuff too. it will become a new status symbol, another way to get a 'like'

as far as getting a hold of the people who dont what it, like militia--and you don't have to be in a militia to not want govt intrusion btw!-- the govt has demonstrated through 'accidents' that they can reach out and touch a large portion of any city's population when they want

look at Flint, MI for example. sure that was lead and the effects of an additive to the treated water that broke down the lead pipes. but if they can do something by accident then they sure as hell can do it on purpose

just add in whatever the hell drug or additive they want to the water. get a whole neighborhood knocked out on GHB and then see if they are pliable enough to be brain wiped or an insertion of whatever tech they may want to put under the skin

wouldn't that be a great way to get a handle on those hood gangsters and their families? be able to track them and what they are doing. gang getting ready to commit a crime? track down their family members, pick them up then force them to turn themselves in. and put it all under some clause in the USA PATRIOT ACT to make it 'legal'

or, use those 'nano machines' that doctors are now testing for med reasons (in the Kaku documentary of health tech)

inject them into some GHB's gang bangers, or anyone, and instead of curing a disease, have them shut down their host's CNS if they are committing a crime or just if some govt operative gets bored.

yes, this is extreme thinking on extreme possibilities, but if it is never considered then all the easier for anyone-govt or corp, to actually do it in the future

i want nothing to do with this tech or those that use it in the future.

 

[Overmind One]

maybe not tothose extremes

but

a concern is for the people who will line up to have this kind of shit in their homes and in their bodies. because you know, just like lining up for the latest i phone or galaxy, the educated idiots, and those plain idiots who aspire to be like them will line up for this stuff too. it will become a new status symbol, another way to get a 'like'

They seem to be grooming the Millennial generation to be submissive and fearful, and they have attacked the very foundations of rational problem solving in the schools. It can no longer be assumed that 2+2=4. Maybe the 2 is just a 2 sometimes, but it feels like a 6, so that means 2+6=8? Exaggerated example, but makes my point. What kind of student can thrive in an environment where he/she is bombarded with far left nonsense and far right nonsense put in the schools by political processes?

as far as getting a hold of the people who dont what it, like militia--and you don't have to be in a militia to not want govt intrusion btw!-- the govt has demonstrated through 'accidents' that they can reach out and touch a large portion of any city's population when they want

look at Flint, MI for example. sure that was lead and the effects of an additive to the treated water that broke down the lead pipes. but if they can do something by accident then they sure as hell can do it on purpose

just add in whatever the hell drug or additive they want to the water. get a whole neighborhood knocked out on GHB and then see if they are pliable enough to be brain wiped or an insertion of whatever tech they may want to put under the skin

Yes, they certainly can.

wouldn't that be a great way to get a handle on those hood gangsters and their families? be able to track them and what they are doing. gang getting ready to commit a crime? track down their family members, pick them up then force them to turn themselves in. and put it all under some clause in the USA PATRIOT ACT to make it 'legal'

or, use those 'nano machines' that doctors are now testing for med reasons (in the Kaku documentary of health tech)

inject them into some GHB's gang bangers, or anyone, and instead of curing a disease, have them shut down their host's CNS if they are committing a crime or just if some govt operative gets bored.

Such a system can never be allowed to exist.

yes, this is extreme thinking on extreme possibilities, but if it is never considered then all the easier for anyone-govt or corp, to actually do it in the future

i want nothing to do with this tech or those that use it in the future.

Ditto. I will not submit to any forced implantation or injections or submit to an AI in the legal system. I would leave this country and renounce my citizenship first.

 

[heisenberg]

Um, NO dude! You really have a very pessimistic view of Humanity if you truly believe this. Do you have any idea what would happen if some government agency tried to force all those rural militia folks who own 80% of all firearms in America to submit to any thing like that? Even an SUV convoy going into a ghetto would have a hard time. Just not gonna happen. Where do you think the muscle to enforce any of this is going to come from? The way it works is that when TPTB cross certain lines, the masses rise up and KILL THEM ALL. That's how it works, EVERY time. Nobody is going to be erasing memories against our will, no organization/force/government will ever overpower the Human race in that fashion. EVER.

Relax dude! You got this...

I was more talking about this. The world will be incredibly organized.

 

[YJ02]

Such a system can never be allowed to exist.

some say the groundwork for such a system has long ago been laid down

 

[YJ02]

I would leave this country and renounce my citizenship first.

yeah but which one?! maybe Papua New Guinea?

so many are already far more along down this invasive route then we are. CCTV cams everywhere, tracking where and when you use your checking card/credit card, how much you are spending, who you associate with...

all of this data is being collected in many nations for (their) legal govt use and for sale to corporations (digital advertising, etc)

 

[PussyGalore]

Our understanding of brain physiology is barely rudimentary at this point. It will be quite awhile before we can selectively remove memories.

 

[Overmind One]

yeah but which one?! maybe Papua New Guinea?

so many are already far more along down this invasive route then we are. CCTV cams everywhere, tracking where and when you use your checking card/credit card, how much you are spending, who you associate with...

all of this data is being collected in many nations for (their) legal govt use and for sale to corporations (digital advertising, etc)

All of the global control systems which exist have the goal of exploiting/managing others (usually the greater masses). Those systems are under the control of a VERY specific group of individuals from a common cultural background, and no others are allowed to join the group. As such, it can never become powerful enough to overpower the global population. There simply aren't enough people willing to enforce the control systems or the goals of the systems. This is why fiat money always fails, why oppressive regimes always fall and why totalitarian governments always end in revolution.

 

[heisenberg]

All of the global control systems which exist have the goal of exploiting/managing others (usually the greater masses). Those systems are under the control of a VERY specific group of individuals from a common cultural background, and no others are allowed to join the group. As such, it can never become powerful enough to overpower the global population. There simply aren't enough people willing to enforce the control systems or the goals of the systems. This is why fiat money always fails, why oppressive regimes always fall and why totalitarian governments always end in revolution.

This clip from George Carlin describes the situation

 

[Overmind One]

This clip from George Carlin describes the situation

:daniel_new_anime021::tealc_newanime006::beckett_thanks:

George gets it.

 

[heisenberg]

:daniel_new_anime021::tealc_newanime006::beckett_thanks:

George gets it.

after having a thorough think about AI, I think everyone here is safe from impending doom. We may get an AI Breakthrough, but I very much doubt it if companies would wide adopt the technology. They might come for our jobs but again, people are uncomfortable with AI or robots. People like talking to people and not only that but has anyone really asked about how much this shit is going to cost? Imagine the enormous infrastructure cost to implement this? Tesla isn't really removing all cars - They'll just mean that no new cars will be petrol and that is being phased out. Fax is still around and still being used today. LOL last work, I used a fan so many times - it's way more secure than email.

People can and will be able to buy their petrol cars for another 30-100 years. Perhaps even longer. Some jobs will be lost but for the most part, it will be small scale and will take decades for it get fully implemented.

 

[heisenberg]

:daniel_new_anime021::tealc_newanime006::beckett_thanks:

George gets it.

All of reddit I see whining cry babies fearing the worst. Did anyone thought that there are over 1000s of cities out there where people could go to if their jobs are under threat? Why not move to another suburb or town? AI won't go to country areas or cities like Detroit(lol). Have people also lost the ability to think critically that they need to spend the time whinging on reddit which they could use that time to better themselves? How about getting into the stock market. Hell, it's providing me comfort learning about it. Instead, I am sure that there will be some dickhead who will commit a crime on what he 'reads' in the news and it will always be a dude because guys are stupid.

The media is also filled with bullshit stories about AI. This sort of nonsense should be banned for spreading FUD and lies. They need to be held accountable and if I was in charge, I would press heavy sanctions and fines for them spreading garbage around.

 

[YJ02]

:daniel_new_anime021::tealc_newanime006::beckett_thanks:

George gets it.

i wonder what is voting record was like? if he did vote, was it for conservatives or libertarians. i can't see him having voted for a liberal

 

[heisenberg]

i wonder what is voting record was like? if he did vote, was it for conservatives or libertarians. i can't see him having voted for a liberal

He was neither left or right.