Gatefan1976
Well Known GateFan
Just what do you folks consider "good scifi"??
What do you consider GOOD science fiction?
- Thread starter Gatefan1976
- Start date
Okay, now that it is a separate thread, I will submit a BASIC set of bullet points which I use for myself:
- GOOD science fiction has GOOD science (based in real scientific principles, not inventing new ones).
- Good science fiction does not have fantasy elements, religious elements or supernatural elements.
- Good science fiction centers around a scientific character, principle or goal, not an interpersonal one.
- Good science fiction maintains consistency in the focus on science throughout the story, and ends with that.
- Good science fiction does not need to rely on sex scenes or action scenes, but may include them IF NECESSARY.
- Good science fiction does not re-hash old stories, or skin the future in 20th century concepts which are already obsolete (use of money, integration of contemporary notions such as national healthcare, politics, racism, etc).
- Every character in a good science fiction story must be fully developed as an INDIVIDUAL and "red shirt" characters should be kept at a minimum
Also, genres that play nice with with good science fiction are:
- Action
- Crime/Police Drama
- Mystery/Intrigue
- Horror
- Romance (as long as it isnt overdone)
- Fantasy
- Comedy
- Religion
- Politics
- Overt sexuality
If somebody can no longer tell what is science fiction and what is not, it becomes apparent when you ask them what they consider good science fiction. If NuBSG, SGU, Defiance, Terra Nova, Falling Skies, Being Human etc etc etc are on the list, you know what you are dealing with.
Last edited:
ParagonPie
Well Known GateFan
Someone like me it all depends on what the creator is trying to do.
I'm actually ok with elements of comedy (kept in tone with the show itself), while I wouldn't follow the religion aspect, spiritual one is fine with me. Politics, again elements every civilization has a system of government so having power play in that and it affecting the characters is always interesting (this was done in SG1 several times quite well if I recall). Sexuality, again fine with as long as it isn't gratuitous, because when you throw boobs or sex scenes in a closet in my face it screams immature mind set, just like any action scene it must be built up to an effective climax - think of that what you will (or established in the world it is currently in as in sex is just casual part of daily life, for example Game of Thrones I know its not sci-fi but most recent example.).
Farscape is probably one of the better science fictions (if not most fun) mostly because it was set to be an alien experience, it also took old science fiction tropes/concepts and turned them on its head (best one is body swap episode), that and awesome characters.
This may sound off topic, but to me also the music/soundtrack/score helps dramatically to establish the setting, world and feeling. This means no freaking sappy guitar with some guy wailing on about how his phone broke so he can't send that cute sms message to his girl friend or whatever. Example below.
Best example of good music I can give right now is funnily enough off of a computer game.
Edit: Star Trek TNG Best of Both Worlds
I'm actually ok with elements of comedy (kept in tone with the show itself), while I wouldn't follow the religion aspect, spiritual one is fine with me. Politics, again elements every civilization has a system of government so having power play in that and it affecting the characters is always interesting (this was done in SG1 several times quite well if I recall). Sexuality, again fine with as long as it isn't gratuitous, because when you throw boobs or sex scenes in a closet in my face it screams immature mind set, just like any action scene it must be built up to an effective climax - think of that what you will (or established in the world it is currently in as in sex is just casual part of daily life, for example Game of Thrones I know its not sci-fi but most recent example.).
Farscape is probably one of the better science fictions (if not most fun) mostly because it was set to be an alien experience, it also took old science fiction tropes/concepts and turned them on its head (best one is body swap episode), that and awesome characters.
This may sound off topic, but to me also the music/soundtrack/score helps dramatically to establish the setting, world and feeling. This means no freaking sappy guitar with some guy wailing on about how his phone broke so he can't send that cute sms message to his girl friend or whatever. Example below.
Best example of good music I can give right now is funnily enough off of a computer game.
Edit: Star Trek TNG Best of Both Worlds
Jim of WVa
Well Known GateFan
Okay, now that it is a separate thread, I will submit a BASIC set of bullet points which I use for myself:
Those are basics. But given all those points, shows like SG-1, Star Trek (TNG, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise) and Atlantis pass without much issue. Shows like SGU, Helix, Defiance, Falling Skies fail on this. These are basic examples, and just my personal opinion.
- GOOD science fiction has GOOD science (based in real scientific principles, not inventing new ones).
- Good science fiction does not have fantasy elements, religious elements or supernatural elements.
- Good science fiction centers around a scientific character, principle or goal, not an interpersonal one.
- Good science fiction maintains consistency in the focus on science throughout the story, and ends with that.
- Good science fiction does not need to rely on sex scenes or action scenes, but may include them IF NECESSARY.
- Good science fiction does not re-hash old stories, or skin the future in 20th century concepts which are already obsolete (use of money, integration of contemporary notions such as national healthcare, politics, racism, etc).
- Every character in a good science fiction story must be fully developed as an INDIVIDUAL and "red shirt" characters should be kept at a minimum
Also, genres that play nice with with good science fiction are:
Those which do not:
- Action
- Crime/Police Drama
- Mystery/Intrigue
- Horror
- Romance (as long as it isnt overdone)
All stories need some interpersonal interaction just to tell the story. But when it becomes the center of the story then it is no longer good science fiction. It becomes what traditional scifi lovers are calling "soap fi" (or something similar).
- Fantasy
- Comedy
- Religion
- Politics
- Overt sexuality
If somebody can no longer tell what is science fiction and what is not, it becomes apparent when you ask them what they consider good science fiction. If NuBSG, SGU, Defiance, Terra Nova, Falling Skies, Being Human etc etc etc are on the list, you know what you are dealing with.
Dune (Frank Herbert) is considered good science fiction by virtually everybody, but there are religious and overt sexual themes in the novels.
Star Trek and Stargate use FTL, which is invented science.
--- merged: Apr 21, 2014 at 6:59 PM ---
Lesbians!!!
Last edited by a moderator:
Bluce Ree
Tech Admin / Council Member
Yeah but each is based in part on real theoretical science. Well, except SGU's FTL, which I haven't a clue what that's based upon.
FTL in Trek has evolved over the years and is properly explained in the canon. The theory still stands today that Einstein's "laws" can be "bent" by creating a field around matter and changing the space within to create a speed/time differential in normal space to achieve FTL. In SGU, everything that had been called "hyperspace" in the previous Stargate series became "FTL" in SGU because in NuBSG it was FTL. They figured that if NuBSG did not have to explain it, they didnt either.
True, but Dune (the movie, the miniseries too) is first and foremost a Drama, then science fiction. It has fantasy elements in it too. Most all of the story contrives the "science" it uses from thin air. I love the stories in the books and on the screen, but I still see it as an amalgam of two or more genres with drama being the most predominant.
Star Trek and Stargate use FTL, which is invented science.
--- merged: Apr 21, 2014 at 6:59 PM ---
Lesbians!!!
Last edited by a moderator:
Jim of WVa
Well Known GateFan
Nope, it is not based upon any science.
Yes, it is. At least sound theoretical science:
http://www.space.com/17628-warp-drive-possible-interstellar-spaceflight.html
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/...h-prepares-to-create-a-warp-bubble-in-the-lab
NuBSGs FTL is not like the others in that there is no hyperspace or such. It is a space folding drive based on superstring theories and written on before by (among others) Stephen Hawking and Kip Thorne.
SGUs "FTL" could be based on fairy dust for all its "realism".
SGUs "FTL" could be based on fairy dust for all its "realism".
Jim of WVa
Well Known GateFan
The theoretical work on the Alcubierre warp drive was done after TOS was off the air.
Bluce Ree
Tech Admin / Council Member
We did, in fact, see it releasing fairy dust into space the entire time. Good call.
Bluce Ree
Tech Admin / Council Member
Yes but the theoretical science behind warped space has been around for a while.
Jim of WVa
Well Known GateFan
Not in reference to a faster than light drive.
Back to what I think good science fiction is....
Basically it needs to actually have science fiction content. No magic or fantasy elements but actual speculative science components.
Within that having economic, social and spiritual components is fine as real human societies have them. As to literary elements, it can have personal relationships so long as they are not the focus of the story.
Now this one is more a preference - while I know valid science fiction can be very dark indeed I like it better when it is properly balanced between darker and lighter elements.
Basically it needs to actually have science fiction content. No magic or fantasy elements but actual speculative science components.
Within that having economic, social and spiritual components is fine as real human societies have them. As to literary elements, it can have personal relationships so long as they are not the focus of the story.
Now this one is more a preference - while I know valid science fiction can be very dark indeed I like it better when it is properly balanced between darker and lighter elements.
shavedape
Well Known GateFan
SGU's FTL = Feel The Love
For SGU it should be: Feel The Lame
Bluce Ree
Tech Admin / Council Member
FTL in Trek has evolved over the years and is properly explained in the canon. The theory still stands today that Einstein's "laws" can be "bent" by creating a field around matter and changing the space within to create a speed/time differential in normal space to achieve FTL. In SGU, everything that had been called "hyperspace" in the previous Stargate series became "FTL" in SGU because in NuBSG it was FTL. They figured that if NuBSG did not have to explain it, they didnt either.
Well, Rush did say that FTL was based on an earlier technology of the ancients that did not go through hyperspace in SGU.