The Pow! Bang! Bam! Plan to Save Marvel

[shavedape]

Interesting article about Marvel comics and how it became a cinematic power house over the last few years:

http://www.businessweek.com/printer...marvels-superhero-at-running-movie-franchises

It’s been four years since Disney purchased Marvel Entertainment for $4 billion. At the time, it wasn’t hailed as a brilliant move. Disney’s stock price sank on news of the deal. Superheroes were hot properties in Hollywood, but Disney was spending billions for a company that had years ago signed away the film rights to its most popular characters. Sony Pictures (SNE) controlled Spider-Man. Fox (FOX) controlled the X-Men, another fan favorite.

All Marvel had left was a cast of lesser costume heroes such as Captain America, whose popularity peaked when he was pummeling Nazis during World War II; Thor, a golden-haired Norse god who spoke in a puzzling Shakespearean dialect; and Ant-Man, a hero who wore a large helmet and could shrink down to the size of an insect. Marvel had surprised skeptics in 2008 with the hit Iron Man, but Captain America, not to mention Ant-Man, looked far less bankable.
...
The success of The Avengers banished any remaining doubts about Iger’s $4 billion investment in Marvel. “It was not clear until they did The Avengers how big Marvel could be,” says Merrill Lynch’s Cohen, acknowledging her earlier lack of faith.

 

[Overmind One]

Interesting article about Marvel comics and how it became a cinematic power house over the last few years:

http://www.businessweek.com/printer...marvels-superhero-at-running-movie-franchises

It’s been four years since Disney purchased Marvel Entertainment for $4 billion. At the time, it wasn’t hailed as a brilliant move. Disney’s stock price sank on news of the deal. Superheroes were hot properties in Hollywood, but Disney was spending billions for a company that had years ago signed away the film rights to its most popular characters. Sony Pictures (SNE) controlled Spider-Man. Fox (FOX) controlled the X-Men, another fan favorite.

All Marvel had left was a cast of lesser costume heroes such as Captain America, whose popularity peaked when he was pummeling Nazis during World War II; Thor, a golden-haired Norse god who spoke in a puzzling Shakespearean dialect; and Ant-Man, a hero who wore a large helmet and could shrink down to the size of an insect. Marvel had surprised skeptics in 2008 with the hit Iron Man, but Captain America, not to mention Ant-Man, looked far less bankable.
...
The success of The Avengers banished any remaining doubts about Iger’s $4 billion investment in Marvel. “It was not clear until they did The Avengers how big Marvel could be,” says Merrill Lynch’s Cohen, acknowledging her earlier lack of faith.

They can easily make the 4 billion back. But I really dont understand why they selected Captain America out of the huge list of characters in the Marvel universe. He is out of place. Like the article said, he peaked when he was pummeling Nazis during WWII. I dont see him growing his fanbase much, except perhaps a few wistful eyed teen girls who think he is hot. That type of "Hero" seems inappropriate today in 2014 America.

 

[shavedape]

They can easily make the 4 billion back. But I really dont understand why they selected Captain America out of the huge list of characters in the Marvel universe. He is out of place. Like the article said, he peaked when he was pummeling Nazis during WWII. I dont see him growing his fanbase much, except perhaps a few wistful eyed teen girls who think he is hot. That type of "Hero" seems inappropriate today in 2014 America.

I think they had an eye towards making The Avengers but wanted to do the individual back stories first. That's what Kevin Feige fought for when he assumed the reins of the Marvel franchise. From what I understand the original Cap A movie made scads of money and the sequel is expected to do even better. And as we all know it's about the money, honey.

DC has got a mountain to climb despite their having Batman and Superman in their stable. They're way behind the curve compared to Marvel.

 

[Gatefan1976]

How are you going to do the Avengers *without* Cap?
Besides, don't you find Cap somewhat refreshingly idealistic and well, heroic in comparison to say Nick Fury?

 

[Overmind One]

How are you going to do the Avengers *without* Cap?
Besides, don't you find Cap somewhat refreshingly idealistic and well, heroic in comparison to say Nick Fury?

I find him cliche.

 

[Gatefan1976]

Of course he is cliché, but who would you rather be in charge, Cap or Nick?
I dunno dude, I just see Cap as a representation of the days when the USA *was* number 1 in so many things. Hopelessly idealistic and unrealistic? sure.

 

[Overmind One]

Of course he is cliché, but who would you rather be in charge, Cap or Nick?
I dunno dude, I just see Cap as a representation of the days when the USA *was* number 1 in so many things. Hopelessly idealistic and unrealistic? sure.

Nick. He is in charge anyway so I am cool with that. Its just that I know the background of Captain America. I know why and when he was created, and by whom.. I know that his "superhuman" strength is not on par with Tony Stark's suit or any of the other people on the Avengers team except Black Widow. That shield of his wasnt anything superhuman until the Avengers, and now he uses it like some sort of Xena boomerang. It even comes to him when he calls it? They are trying desperately to wipe away his origins and give him new ones so they can still have a Captain America without having him killing Germans and Japanese. They took away the red white and blue flag these and have tried to black it out with all sorts of cool carbon fiber and grey accents, but he is still Captain America, Nazi killer.

Why didnt they form up a different team? Replace Captain America with Cannonball or Spider Man. Why revive Captain America and not Cannonball?

 

[shavedape]

From what I understand SONY owns the rights to Spiderman and that's why we won't see Spidey appearing in The Avengers anytime soon. Same with Fantastic Four which is owned by someone else. No cross overs are expected in the near future due to the licensing issues.

 

[Overmind One]

From what I understand SONY owns the rights to Spiderman and that's why we won't see Spidey appearing in The Avengers anytime soon. Same with Fantastic Four which is owned by someone else. No cross overs are expected in the near future due to the licensing issues.

I kinda also feel the same way about Superman as I do about Captain America. Cannonball belongs to Marvel, and although I see him more with the X-Men, he has a place in the Avengers and has been a part of the team in the comics. Why isnt Falcon in the Captain America movies?

 

[Gatefan1976]

Falcon is:
http://theurbandaily.com/2014/04/04/falcon-captain-america-winter-soldier-wiki/

 

[Overmind One]

Falcon is:
http://theurbandaily.com/2014/04/04/falcon-captain-america-winter-soldier-wiki/

Well, I havent seen it yet! But it is good they have him in there, since he was there from a while back.

 

[Gatefan1976]

I haven't seen it yet either, I was supposed to have, but the best laid plans..........

 

[shavedape]

 

[Backstep]

Where is his Kiwi sidekick?

 

[Gatefan1976]

Where is his Kiwi sidekick?

Bugger that, where are his speedo's, boomerang and beer?

 

[Overmind One]

Seriously though...

Marvel's stable of super heroes is bulging with much better candidates than Captain America on the Avengers team (and standalone movies).

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/kagetaicho/lists/100-most-powerful-marvel-characters/10144/

This is the Wiki of Avenger teams over the years:


With all those interesting characters, why spend so much time and energy bringing Captain America forward and making him into a franchise when they could develop one of their cooler characters? They did very very will with Iron Man, Hulk, Thor, Spider Man, and the little we have seen of Black Widow and Nick Fury. Of those, they have decided to make Thor, Iron Man and Captain America into independent franchises for movies. Can you imagine a Silver Surfer movie?

I dunno...Captain America...it just doesn't sound right today. Lets not forget about this guy (on the left) either:

Yep, that is Captain Britain standing next to Captain America. . While they are at resurrecting WWII comic book relics, why not also resurrect the Red Guardian too?

 

[Gatefan1976]

Ok, lets put aside how we feel about them for a moment.

Who in your estimation would be a *better* replacement for Cap?
I mean, sure, their are other hero's but would any really grab the attention of people?
Cap is an *Ideal*, a good one, he is a real hero. He is also (canonically) a founding member of the Avengers, so he makes sense to be there in the movies.

I suppose we could wax lyrical about the political ideals behind having him when Cap came out as a movie, or the perceived (and proven actual) box office value of the character in comparison to say Elektra, Daredevil, Punisher or Ghost Rider, but that's fairly dry stuff.
You also then have to consider just who Marvel Movies still owns as Ape pointed out. X-men, Spiderman, Fantastic Four are all owned by other companies, so anyone in them is sorta "out of bounds" to the current Marvel slate.

I get your POV dude, he *IS* a bit of a wanker, but he makes sense within the universe.

 

[shavedape]

Plus I think a lot of the choice has to do with being so basic. Viewers unfamiliar with the comics (and there are millions) find it easier to understand who these superheroes are. But when you start getting into the more obscure superheroes it becomes harder for people to follow. As it is I had to figure out who Hawkeye was as I'm not that familiar with him. Same with Black Widow, who I've heard of but wasn't up to speed on. If The Avengers was all lesser known entities it wouldn't be as successful.

So initially they need characters like Cap A and Ironman. As it is they're introducing other characters already, like Scarlett Witch, who appears in Winter Soldier credits scene and will be in the next Avengers movie.

As for Cap A, I gotta admit I do like the contrast his naivete' and innocence brings to the whole mix. It would be boring if everyone walked around making snarky comments like Tony Stark. It helps to have that balance. Granted, I don't know how much mileage they will get out of the Cap A character. What I mean is, I don't see them remaking and rebooting the character every couple years they way they do with Spiderman and (DC does with) Batman. I think these Chris Evans movies are pretty much it for stand alone Cap A movies in the future.

 

[shavedape]

https://movies.yahoo.com/news/captain-america-blows-box-office-boffo-203-mil-161524602.html

‘Captain America’ Blows Up Weekend Box Office With Boffo $203 Mil Globally, Scores Record $96 Mil Stateside

The Marvel machine continues to be a wonder at the box office, with “Captain America: The Winter Soldier” amassing a whammo $203.3 million worldwide this weekend, of which an estimated $96.2 million came from Stateside plexes, making it the largest domestic debut ever in April.

To date, “Winter Soldier” has raked in an overwhelming $300 million-plus global tally, with several overseas territories bowing the pic last weekend. The film now is playing in approximately 92% of the international market place.

In China, “Winter Soldier” scored the largest opening for a Disney-Marvel film with $39.2 million, which is 16% larger than “Iron Man 3.” Russia and Australia also each contributed No. 1 bows locally, grossing $7.4 million and $6 million, respectively.

The huge Stateside opening for “Winter Soldier,” which included a benchmark $9.6 million from Imax (with 9 of the film’s top 10-grossing theaters) and $6.5 million from other premium-large format screens, is nearly 50% larger than the original’s opening in 2011. The Herculean improvement is attributed mostly to the inundation of the Marvel brand over the last few years.

“Records aside, this is a testament to the momentum created within the Marvel universe for each of these characters to become something greater than themselves,” said Disney distribution topper Dave Hollis, adding that the film is well positioned during spring break to take advantage of an already strong word-of-mouth play.

 

[Overmind One]

Ok, lets put aside how we feel about them for a moment.

Who in your estimation would be a *better* replacement for Cap?

Cannonball. He is in the Avengers team canon, he has ACTUAL superpowers like Thor and Hulk.

I mean, sure, their are other hero's but would any really grab the attention of people?
Cap is an *Ideal*, a good one, he is a real hero. He is also (canonically) a founding member of the Avengers, so he makes sense to be there in the movies.

Cap is getting attention because his movies are hyped and just what else is there? He isnt a real superhero in the spirit of the rest of the team. He belongs in a group with Captain Britain, Red Guardian, General Ling and all that WWII stuff.

I suppose we could wax lyrical about the political ideals behind having him when Cap came out as a movie, or the perceived (and proven actual) box office value of the character in comparison to say Elektra, Daredevil, Punisher or Ghost Rider, but that's fairly dry stuff.
You also then have to consider just who Marvel Movies still owns as Ape pointed out. X-men, Spiderman, Fantastic Four are all owned by other companies, so anyone in them is sorta "out of bounds" to the current Marvel slate.

They still own Cannonball and all of the cool Guardians of the Galaxy heroes in Thor's world with Odin. They have the Destroyer which we have seen, they have Silver Surfer, there are others they can use.

I get your POV dude, he *IS* a bit of a wanker, but he makes sense within the universe.

Oh yeah, I know he is one of the old school Avengers, as is Black Widow and Hawkeye, But he is still a bit TOO old school. When he was invented, there were no computers, no internet, no cellphones and no VTOL aircraft, let alone rockets and space stations and lasers. Captain America was challenged by fighting Nazis, so how useful can he be in the long run? I find him boring and cliche, like Superman.

BUT, they are making hundreds of millions on him. I get that.